Our 2001 Concourse rear entry door has a large bulge on the exterior below the door handle/lock. I suspect this is from chronic water leakage from around this hardware and subsequent freeze/thaw action.
I've seen where some have actually taken the door apart and rebuilt it. However, a search of this site hasn't come up with anyone who actually bought and installed a new door. I would prefer this instead of a rebuild.
So my questions are:
- Has anyone actually bought and replaced their rear entry door?
- If so, where did they get the new door?
- Is the door a custom fit or a standard sized RV entry door?
- Any other suggestions/recommendations?
Thanks
Replacing Rear Entry Door
-
VTSweetpea
- Posts: 91
- Joined: May 9th, 2016, 12:19 pm
Replacing Rear Entry Door
2001 Concourse 4x4
Re: Replacing Rear Entry Door
I replaced the rear door on my 2000 Concourse last June. The original rear entry door was steel and very solid. I miss it.
The door I bought was through Carid
"24" x 72" Passenger Side Radius Entry Door (V000051931) by Lippert Components". They no longer have it listed. I gave a fairly poor review for it (deleted from the Carid website when they removed the door), though in fairness it may be most or all of the new rear doors that are available have many of the same issues. It is aluminum, and the screen door in particular is very cheap, thin, aluminum (the screws to hold the plastic door handle stripped out in a few days). The door does not feel nearly as solid as the old one, though it does make a nice clunk when closed, and has good rubber seals that are tight and solid. Oh, and the frame itself was slightly bent out on the upper right corner (1/16"-1/8"), probably at the factory from the look of it (didn't look like it was bent in shipping, more like it was made slightly off).
The size is correct (or close to it), at 24" x 72", though the original door in mine was built slightly different, in that the frame had a lip that was both an inch higher and an inch lower, and also slightly wider. Because of this I had to built down the top of the wood frame and then cover that with Bondo Hair fiberglass filler to make it water-proof (just what I had on hand, not sure if that was the best thing to use). I also had to build-out/fill about an inch on both sides, where the old door handle was, and the hinges. Because none of the screw holes lined up, I filled all the old holes as well, to waterproof them (the new frame isn't quite as wide as the old one, so the old screw holes were very close to the edge of the frame in some places). And, finally, because the bottom was shorter, I filled out over and around the wood on the bottom step with Bondo (all-purpose putty this time) to make sure it was waterproof in case a bit of water got pushed up under there when driving in rain or through puddles. The door frame bottom does come down over that wood, but just barely.
Here are a few pictures to give you an idea of the issues I found. If you look close on the first one, you can see the pen marker line I had along the top and sides that marks where the new door fits - the curve of it was not the same, so the corners come very close to the edge of the RV fiberglass frame, which is why I built it out, to make sure there was a wide enough piece for the butyl tape to seal water out (in that image the screw holes have not yet been filled in). You can also see in the last image with the measuring tape that the door is actually slightly wider than the standard 24" (looks to me like it is just over 24.5" to the fiberglass, not including their cutout for the hinge). It is also slightly taller than the 72" standard. Figures Chinook would use some kind of custom door - solid, quality, but difficult to replace.
Good luck, maybe you'll find a better door than me, and have less issues with the old frame.
Bob
The door I bought was through Carid
"24" x 72" Passenger Side Radius Entry Door (V000051931) by Lippert Components". They no longer have it listed. I gave a fairly poor review for it (deleted from the Carid website when they removed the door), though in fairness it may be most or all of the new rear doors that are available have many of the same issues. It is aluminum, and the screen door in particular is very cheap, thin, aluminum (the screws to hold the plastic door handle stripped out in a few days). The door does not feel nearly as solid as the old one, though it does make a nice clunk when closed, and has good rubber seals that are tight and solid. Oh, and the frame itself was slightly bent out on the upper right corner (1/16"-1/8"), probably at the factory from the look of it (didn't look like it was bent in shipping, more like it was made slightly off).
The size is correct (or close to it), at 24" x 72", though the original door in mine was built slightly different, in that the frame had a lip that was both an inch higher and an inch lower, and also slightly wider. Because of this I had to built down the top of the wood frame and then cover that with Bondo Hair fiberglass filler to make it water-proof (just what I had on hand, not sure if that was the best thing to use). I also had to build-out/fill about an inch on both sides, where the old door handle was, and the hinges. Because none of the screw holes lined up, I filled all the old holes as well, to waterproof them (the new frame isn't quite as wide as the old one, so the old screw holes were very close to the edge of the frame in some places). And, finally, because the bottom was shorter, I filled out over and around the wood on the bottom step with Bondo (all-purpose putty this time) to make sure it was waterproof in case a bit of water got pushed up under there when driving in rain or through puddles. The door frame bottom does come down over that wood, but just barely.
Here are a few pictures to give you an idea of the issues I found. If you look close on the first one, you can see the pen marker line I had along the top and sides that marks where the new door fits - the curve of it was not the same, so the corners come very close to the edge of the RV fiberglass frame, which is why I built it out, to make sure there was a wide enough piece for the butyl tape to seal water out (in that image the screw holes have not yet been filled in). You can also see in the last image with the measuring tape that the door is actually slightly wider than the standard 24" (looks to me like it is just over 24.5" to the fiberglass, not including their cutout for the hinge). It is also slightly taller than the 72" standard. Figures Chinook would use some kind of custom door - solid, quality, but difficult to replace.
Good luck, maybe you'll find a better door than me, and have less issues with the old frame.
Bob
Re: Replacing Rear Entry Door
Not as comprehensive as Bob's post, but I posted this in an old thread:
I took a few measurements, and bought a replacement door from ebay. I cant remember the name of the outfit. I just searched "RV door" with matching dimensions. The radii match fine, and it's essentially the same construction as the stock unit except it's a lot lighter. The holes didn't line up, but drilling new holes was easy. It required a bit of fiddling but the job wasn't horrible.
I pried the old one off, and installed the replacement with new SS screws and butyl. It's much lighter, has better latching hardware, it clicks shut just so nicely, and has a better screen door. The old door was self-destructing at the bottom from washboard roads, the seal was not a seal anymore, it required an NFL lineman to shut it, the screen door needed attention, and it was a weird off-white on the inside panel. So I just replaced the whole thing. Then I gave away the old door to a very appreciative gentleman from Craigslist who was building a "cabin."
I took a few measurements, and bought a replacement door from ebay. I cant remember the name of the outfit. I just searched "RV door" with matching dimensions. The radii match fine, and it's essentially the same construction as the stock unit except it's a lot lighter. The holes didn't line up, but drilling new holes was easy. It required a bit of fiddling but the job wasn't horrible.
I pried the old one off, and installed the replacement with new SS screws and butyl. It's much lighter, has better latching hardware, it clicks shut just so nicely, and has a better screen door. The old door was self-destructing at the bottom from washboard roads, the seal was not a seal anymore, it required an NFL lineman to shut it, the screen door needed attention, and it was a weird off-white on the inside panel. So I just replaced the whole thing. Then I gave away the old door to a very appreciative gentleman from Craigslist who was building a "cabin."
1994 Premier
Re: Replacing Rear Entry Door
Just read Scott's post and it reminded me on drilling the new holes. Maybe because the fiberglass is older, or maybe its just fiberglass (I had no experience working in fiberglass), but I found I needed to be very careful drilling each pilot hole, or hairline cracks started radiating away from the new hole in the fiberglass (or maybe it was just the gel layer on top?). The procedure I ended up with that worked great was 3 steps per pilot hole (think I read about it somewhere on the Internet):
1) drill hole through the fiberglass and into the wood that was a bit smaller than the thickness of the screw shaft (basically using the minor diameter suggested for pilot holes into a soft wood for the screw size). The plywood backing seemed like a normal soft wood and I wanted it to grip the screw tightly.
2) carefully countersink the hole wider than the thickness of the screw shaft. I think there was even one time where the gel started cracking then and I reversed the rotation, a trick I read about where you can often still get the countersink done but it is slower and less stressful on the material. I bought 2 countersink bits, the second one I bought after using the first - it was more expensive but also sharper and produced noticeably smoother cuts.
3) drill into the middle of the countersunk hole again, but just through the fiberglass this time (not into the plywood behind it), using a bit that was a fraction wider than the screw shaft (like 1/64" or 1/32", I think I may have gone with the size suggested for pilot holes into a hard wood for the screw size, or maybe 1/64" larger than that). Without this second thicker pilot hole the fit into the fiberglass was too tight and the screw would bind or a crack would start to form.
This way the screw was biting solid into the wood, biting a bit into the fiberglass, and because the countersink at the top was fractionally larger than that last bit I used, no cracks occurred. Was kind of a pain in the ass, but after twice getting those cracks in my first 2 holes, this method suddenly wasn't feeling like too much trouble.
1) drill hole through the fiberglass and into the wood that was a bit smaller than the thickness of the screw shaft (basically using the minor diameter suggested for pilot holes into a soft wood for the screw size). The plywood backing seemed like a normal soft wood and I wanted it to grip the screw tightly.
2) carefully countersink the hole wider than the thickness of the screw shaft. I think there was even one time where the gel started cracking then and I reversed the rotation, a trick I read about where you can often still get the countersink done but it is slower and less stressful on the material. I bought 2 countersink bits, the second one I bought after using the first - it was more expensive but also sharper and produced noticeably smoother cuts.
3) drill into the middle of the countersunk hole again, but just through the fiberglass this time (not into the plywood behind it), using a bit that was a fraction wider than the screw shaft (like 1/64" or 1/32", I think I may have gone with the size suggested for pilot holes into a hard wood for the screw size, or maybe 1/64" larger than that). Without this second thicker pilot hole the fit into the fiberglass was too tight and the screw would bind or a crack would start to form.
This way the screw was biting solid into the wood, biting a bit into the fiberglass, and because the countersink at the top was fractionally larger than that last bit I used, no cracks occurred. Was kind of a pain in the ass, but after twice getting those cracks in my first 2 holes, this method suddenly wasn't feeling like too much trouble.
Re: Replacing Rear Entry Door
I wonder if lubricant should be used on the screw, as well as sealant, to make it easier to install the screw without drilling a larger second pilot hole.
2000 Concourse dinette, on 1999 6.8L Ford E350 Triton V-10 Chassis
Re: Replacing Rear Entry Door
Bob has the right idea. It's common for gelcoated fiberglass to crack when driving screws in or through it. In fact, most of the holes in my Chinook (and boat) showed evidence of some cracking/chipping around them when initially removing screws for re-bedding or replacing something (along with a bit of lifted material). Chamfering took care of it most times (but doing it first is better).
Certain types of bits, tape over the area when drilling, or a slightly oversized hole also work (the latter obviously works better if you are using a machine screw and nut).
Another benefit to a bit of chamfering is that it makes a little "well" for bedding compound/sealant.
Certain types of bits, tape over the area when drilling, or a slightly oversized hole also work (the latter obviously works better if you are using a machine screw and nut).
Another benefit to a bit of chamfering is that it makes a little "well" for bedding compound/sealant.
1999 Concourse
Re: Replacing Rear Entry Door
Oh, I forgot to list that step, call it step 4.
4) I wrapped a little of the butyl tape around each screw's threads before screwing it in. My understanding is you should always do that, to diminish the possibility of water slipping in along the threads over time. I usually ended up with a little bit of butyl showing up around the bedded screw's head (squeezed out as the screw went in).
chin_k, I think the problem with the hole size is that the soft plywood has give in it, so you need a smaller hole to make the screw go in tight to grip the wood, while the fiberglass has almost no give in it. It isn't just friction that keeps the screw from going into the fiberglass, it is simply the hole is a bit too small - and either the screw binds because of the pressure, or you force it and maybe crack the fiberglass. The butyl tape does make it go in a bit smoother, but it still binds with the smaller hole (I did try that initially). Given that there are so many screws in the frame, you might be able to just go with the larger hole into both fiberglass and wood - but I tend to have bad luck and didn't want some part of the door pulling a bit loose in a few years because I didn't take the extra time and effort to use the 2 hole sizing.
4) I wrapped a little of the butyl tape around each screw's threads before screwing it in. My understanding is you should always do that, to diminish the possibility of water slipping in along the threads over time. I usually ended up with a little bit of butyl showing up around the bedded screw's head (squeezed out as the screw went in).
chin_k, I think the problem with the hole size is that the soft plywood has give in it, so you need a smaller hole to make the screw go in tight to grip the wood, while the fiberglass has almost no give in it. It isn't just friction that keeps the screw from going into the fiberglass, it is simply the hole is a bit too small - and either the screw binds because of the pressure, or you force it and maybe crack the fiberglass. The butyl tape does make it go in a bit smoother, but it still binds with the smaller hole (I did try that initially). Given that there are so many screws in the frame, you might be able to just go with the larger hole into both fiberglass and wood - but I tend to have bad luck and didn't want some part of the door pulling a bit loose in a few years because I didn't take the extra time and effort to use the 2 hole sizing.
-
VTSweetpea
- Posts: 91
- Joined: May 9th, 2016, 12:19 pm
Re: Replacing Rear Entry Door
Thank you all for the replies and tips! BobW9 - your detailed description and pics were especially helpful. I will keep the forum posted on my efforts to find a new replacement door and install it.
2001 Concourse 4x4
-
tealchinook
- Posts: 2
- Joined: October 7th, 2018, 10:38 am
Re: Replacing Rear Entry Door
VTSweetpea, didn't Tom Jackson mention at the Colfax rally that he has now got a source for replacement back doors? Have you checked with him?
-
VTSweetpea
- Posts: 91
- Joined: May 9th, 2016, 12:19 pm
Re: Replacing Rear Entry Door
tealchinook yes- apparently Tom J did mention that at Colfax. Will contact him. Thanks!
2001 Concourse 4x4