First, thanks for all the detailed responses. It says a lot about this community that you'd take the time to respond to a noob that doesn't even have a Chinook!
One thing I didn't go into detail on is how we plan to use a Chinook. For years I've been toying with the idea of seeing the entire country with my family. Instead of trying to cram it in to one trip, we'd take a week or two to explore and wherever we end up we'll park the rig in RV storage and fly home. We'll return to the point we left off by air the next time we can string some time together. Rinse and repeat whenever the kids have time off of school, and for a more extended period in the summer. I'm really fortunate that I own a business that generates a few million credit card points a year, so the air travel (and hotels when the girls get tired of being crammed in a Chinook) are covered, and my team is good enough that I can be gone for extended periods of time.
That's one reason I want something small (as opposed to a larger class C), why I don't want to tow a trailer, and why having a chase car with the kids in it won't really work for me, although those are all super valid ideas.
While I think a Roof Top Tent would be really cool, I'm open to all of the other ideas.
HoosierB wrote:
A rear entry tent could be fabricated to fit your needs, allow for way more space (a whole extra room!) and could even expand as the family needs grow.
Awesome idea. I have a "Add A Room" for my bus that mounts to the gutter rail on the passenger side (which is a PITA to set up), and another small tent that hangs of the rear hatch. We use to put daughter #3 in a pack 'n play in it. Worked great and makes the bus seem huge. I think this is an especially good idea for when we plan on staying in one spot for multiple nights. Thank you.
kdarling wrote:I've thought about this situation a lot myself, and one of the easiest solutions is creating breakdown bunk beds.
For example, over the dinette and/or sofa sides. That gives two or three more sleeping spots.
....
You could make knockdown bunks out of aluminum or PVC tubes, and/or modified camping cots, with mounting slots attached to the top of the dinette backs. Or build a folding baseboard for the dinette. Or get clever and design a pullout dinette bunk that normally rolls up like a window shade against the dinette window.
These bunks, along with the stock California King created by the sofa + dinette seats, should easily provide the sleeping room you need.
The only downside for the parents would be getting stepped on when a kid needs to use the bathroom in the middle of the night
Kevin
Thanks Kevin. I actually have the sleeping area over the front seats in my bus which was a Westfalia option called a "Child's Cot", although the canvas was too rotten to use. I love the idea of bunk beds. I think I've seen images of Chinooks that had it as an option? Short of finding one that had that option, I think having them made is doable. I'd probably see if I can find someone to fabricate two out of aluminum that would set up quick, and employ the over front seat option as well. That would get me enough sleeping areas, at least while the kids are small (when they're older, they're not going to want to do this anyway, so that's moot). It's important to me that we have an option like this that is enclosed and would be a relatively quick set up and break down for nights that we pull in somewhere late, or when we spend the night in a Walmart parking lot.
deppstein wrote:Bret--Your post has sparked memories, as well as thoughts.
Background: I am the very happy owner of a 2004 Chinook Premier (rear entrance dinette layout). My wife and I have traveled for six weeks at a time (Nova Scotia/Newfoundland, cross country from Boston to Montana, Nova Scotia-New Brunswick-Quebec-Gaspe, and most recently circumnavigated the Great Lakes. The Premier is perfect for our needs--ample room for the two of us, layout works well, yet it is small enough for us to get back into remote "tent" sites wherever we go. We tend not to hook-up (200 watt solar suitcase for charging batteries) and HATE the RV designated areas.
Relative to your post, I also grew up in a family of five kids that camped all the time. In particular, my father built two different types of campers that we used to travel around in during his two-week vacations (the bad old days). The first was a 1962 VW micro bus that he modified by cutting off the roof just behind the front bench seat all the way to the back, and mounting a rowboat upside down as the roof...giving us full head room in back, and some storage up over the front seat. In the van itself, he built benches on either side using canvas and metal tubing--a bench for sitting, a similar back that lay flat against the wall for sitting, and folded up for sleeping. There was also an additional canvas bunk (similarly made) that was attached to the wall above the middle bench/back and angled up toward the ceiling during the day, and lowered for sleeping. He liked to say that it was modeled after submarine quarters...18" between bunks--enough for rolling over. That took care of six of us, and my youngest sister slept on the bench seat in front. Crazy, huh! Drove my Mom nuts! Anyway, it worked for travel and sleeping, but we had to do all of our cooking, eating, washing, cleaning, toilet stuff at campsites.
Soooo, after a couple of years, he bagged that idea, and bought a 1952 GMC 47-passenger school bus that he proceeded to outfit as a full camper. It had a dining area (table converted to double bed for my parents, a kitchen area, enclosed bathroom, and bunks/benches that were similar to what we had in the VW. We used that for years. Plenty of room, but not something that you could squeeze into tent campsites like we can do with our Chinook currently.
All this to say, that I come to your post with current Chinook knowledge and past large family cross country travel camping experience.
From that vantage point, I would discourage you from trying to shoe-horn all six of you into the Rig itself. I think that a Premier or Concourse is the perfect vehicle for your family of six to travel in and use at a campsite. But, if I were you, I would focus on outside sleeping for the kids...pitching a regular tent or something along the lines of a custom build-out from back door or utilizing the awning, as shown in one of the pics on this post. Based on my experience, both current and past, the Concourse or Premier is just to small to have six people moving around in it as you work to set things up from daily to night activity.
I'll let this serve as am "two-cents" on the topic for now. Feel free to come back at me for more information (past or present).
David
David - Your dad is a man after my own heart! I love that he crammed 5 kids in a barn door bus with a row boat roof and the GMC bus sounds awesomely ridiculous. I'd love to see pictures if you ever come across them. I totally get your point about the Chinook being to small to be comfortable for camping, and you're right. On the other hand, the more comfortable it is the more time they'll want to spend inside of it on iPads.
Blue~Go wrote:Welcome! This is an interesting topic, and I can tell you've thought about it quite a bit. I didn't grow up in a family of six and no VW bus back then (we had a cabin instead but I always wanted a bus!). I have had a camper van though, and now have my Concourse.
I'm also going to be on the "I don't think it's the best candidate" side, and here's why. Well, but wait, I do want to say that you seem like the type to think outside the box and make things work, and I know that can go a loong way. People circumnavigate in boats the size of a bathtub. But on the other hand if someone asked me if that sounded good, I'd probably suggest something a little larger (but not huge, maybe 24')...
BG - Thanks for the detailed reply. The bit about sailing is a bathtub brought back memories of trips to Catalina on my grandparents Cal 27, maybe that's where my love of being packed into small spaces with too many people for extended periods of time came from. I'm a member of a sailing club now in Southern Cal, although the family isn't as in love with sailing as I am because they get sea sick. Your point about the seat belts is well taken. My original thoughts were to rip out everything forward of the door and behind the front seats and install two rows of captains chairs out of a Toyota Sienna. They're readily available out of handicap van conversions, are super comfortable and have a relatively small footprint. We have a Sienna now, they're good seats. There are also swivel bases for them, the guy that was going to build out my E350 fabricates them. I would then have bunk beds made to be deployed above them as described above. Obviously, this route would never give us enough sleeping areas (without an RTT).
As I've scoured this site I've been enlightened on the GRVW issue, and it's definitely a concern. Anybody ever refit one with E450 axles?
Regarding converting an E350, that's still on the table. There's a reason I haven't sold the one I have (I went so far as to take pictures of it to list in on CL, but I couldn't bring myself to do it). We could get everything we want, sans a toilet/shower. One of the big issues for me is the pop-top that's on the market that's big enough for us (not Sportsmobile, it's larger, it covers the entire length of the roof and when opened is high enough to sit up there) is made and installed by a company that has an awful reputation. I've seen their work. The guy I mentioned above that was going to build out my E350 is supposed to be designing a top, but I haven't seen anything yet.
As for the ability of a Chinook to get off the beaten path, my plan would be to install a lift that would help with the overhand and plumbing issues, if a Baja came along at a good price I might snatch it up.
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So here's where I'm at:
I realize that there isn't a vehicle that will give me everything I'm looking for. If I go with the EB E350 I'll sacrifice a toilet/shower. If I go with a Chinook sleeping will be tough, especially if we change the seating to something safer and still somehow manage enough sleeping for 2 adults and 4 kids. I'm leaning away from the RTT now (I really do hate the idea of cutting up the roof). Getting a slightly larger Class C will make getting off the beaten path impossible, but might actually be a good way of getting our feet wet. To that end, I rented a Class B from Cruise American to test out with the family and go camping with some friends in a few weeks. I hate the idea of something that big, but I'll see how it goes. Shoot, maybe we should just get one way rentals from Cruise American and get the party started towards the end of this summer.
All that said, I'm still leaning towards figuring out a way to make a Chinook work!