Ultimate suspension?

[dougm]

Its still a truck and its a heavy truck weighing in at 10,400 lbs dry, thats over 5 tons. You can throw parts at it for the next 10 years and it will still ride like a 5 ton truck. Part of the problem is they have such limited suspension travel, lifting it helps some if you use springs to do it versus blocks because you increase the travel distance before the suspension hits the bump stops. Once you start lifting an I-beam suspension you start running into alignment issues, sometimes even finding a shop that will attempt an alignment can be a challenge once they realize it isnt factory suspension. Then you have the ones that will do an alignment and try to use factory specs on a lifted truck and you end up with your truck wandering all over the road. But again its a truck, its never going to ride like the family sedan no matter what you do.

[FatBuoy]

Its still a truck and its a heavy truck weighing in at 10,400 lbs dry, thats over 5 tons. You can throw parts at it for the next 10 years and it will still ride like a 5 ton truck. Part of the problem is they have such limited suspension travel, lifting it helps some if you use springs to do it versus blocks because you increase the travel distance before the suspension hits the bump stops. Once you start lifting an I-beam suspension you start running into alignment issues, sometimes even finding a shop that will attempt an alignment can be a challenge once they realize it isnt factory suspension. Then you have the ones that will do an alignment and try to use factory specs on a lifted truck and you end up with your truck wandering all over the road. But again its a truck, its never going to ride like the family sedan no matter what you do.

Ok Buzzie McBuzzkill! lol! Just messing with you. I agree.

I'm pretty sure I'll never do this but, again, here's the video for the lift solution that could be a game changer. It includes reworked I-beams to address to what you are referring. But a 6" lift. Wow. With that much, I would assume you would be going larger on the tires, which would put you another 1" or more higher. Pretty soon you would have to put red airline warning lights on the a/c unit! I think it would ride nicer, and have more clearance, but there's always a trade-off. That being $4k + installation, and having to worry more about top clearance. Shoot, at 7" higher, it would start becoming a PIA to enter and exit as well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65TNK3hKUsc

[chin_k]

When I was looking for new tires, I think I found that the E350 can take a larger tire and give it an extra inch. I only remember that it is for the front tires, so I don't know if the duallies can be "upgraded" the same way. It probably don't have large enough wheel well to put a larger tire in there.

[ltg]

The statement that "Chinook added a gazillion pounds without suspension mods" is not entirely correct. Trail Wagons used three different suspension modifications: MorRyde, Firestone Air Bags, and the Maxloader Springs. Different models used different modifications. And some were options. It is true that some models in some years did not have any suspension modifications.

[FatBuoy]

The statement that "Chinook added a gazillion pounds without suspension mods" is not entirely correct. Trail Wagons used three different suspension modifications: MorRyde, Firestone Air Bags, and the Maxloader Springs. Different models used different modifications. And some were options. It is true that some models in some years did not have any suspension modifications.

Thanks for the clarification. How would one tell if it had the Maxloader springs?

[ltg]

Maxloader springs are installed under the factory leaf springs and above the rear axle. In between the factory springs and axle.
If you google "Maxloader Springs Images", you can see pictures of the Maxloader springs.
Our 2005 Glacier has the Maxloader Springs. Some Glaciers we are aware of do not have them.

[dougm]

Its still a truck and its a heavy truck weighing in at 10,400 lbs dry, thats over 5 tons. You can throw parts at it for the next 10 years and it will still ride like a 5 ton truck. Part of the problem is they have such limited suspension travel, lifting it helps some if you use springs to do it versus blocks because you increase the travel distance before the suspension hits the bump stops. Once you start lifting an I-beam suspension you start running into alignment issues, sometimes even finding a shop that will attempt an alignment can be a challenge once they realize it isnt factory suspension. Then you have the ones that will do an alignment and try to use factory specs on a lifted truck and you end up with your truck wandering all over the road. But again its a truck, its never going to ride like the family sedan no matter what you do.

Ok Buzzie McBuzzkill! lol! Just messing with you. I agree.

I'm pretty sure I'll never do this but, again, here's the video for the lift solution that could be a game changer. It includes reworked I-beams to address to what you are referring. But a 6" lift. Wow. With that much, I would assume you would be going larger on the tires, which would put you another 1" or more higher. Pretty soon you would have to put red airline warning lights on the a/c unit! I think it would ride nicer, and have more clearance, but there's always a trade-off. That being $4k + installation, and having to worry more about top clearance. Shoot, at 7" higher, it would start becoming a PIA to enter and exit as well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65TNK3hKUsc

It is not a game changer. Its what i have on the front of mine. They use 1/2 ton f150/bronco coilsprings on front. Its nearly impossible to get aligned properly.
There are others that have it and have posted how much they love it. But if you get on expedition portal and the sportsmobile forum, you will find a common theme, complaints about not being able to get a proper alignment. In fact mine is coming off this summer to convert to 4x4 so if you wanna try your luck you can buy mine. I wont even get into the steering box issue.

[dougm]

When I was looking for new tires, I think I found that the E350 can take a larger tire and give it an extra inch. I only remember that it is for the front tires, so I don't know if the duallies can be "upgraded" the same way. It probably don't have large enough wheel well to put a larger tire in there.

If you look at the decal in your driver side door jam. it lists the OEM tire size as a P225-75\16 with an optional size being a P245-75\16.
Im running 245's on mine front and back, have been since i bought it years back, no issues. Let me correct myself somewhat here... if you decide you want to run a P245-75\16 you need to be careful which tire brand you buy as believe it or not some are wider than others. I installed a new set of Michelins and then stood behind the truck looking at the dually tire from behind. The sidewalls of the tires were touching each other, barely but they were. I had BFG AT tires installed instead and they have plenty of space between the sidewalls. Just one of those things you gotta watch i guess...

[Blue~Go]

I'd also take some issue with "Chinook added a ton of weight with no mods," because a chassis cab (i.e. cab with bare frame, as delivered by Ford) are *meant* to have weight added. If you look through the Ford Incomplete Vehicle Manual, it explains what can and can't be added and how it should be done (this is what an RV company uses when building a Class C from a chassis cab (incomplete vehicle). It is filled with design recommendations, including for suspension and steering, frame extensions (not applicable to 21-footers), electrical - you name it. Basically all systems are addressed.

That's not to say any RV builder follows them all (although Chinook seems to have done well; doesn't hurt that they essentially built the same RV for decades). But chassis cabs are expected to have things such as RV bodies attached to them (following spec).

Our 21-ers are close to the upper limits for an E-350 (especially as feature creep continued into the mid-2000's), but on the other hand, they'd be pretty small for an E-450 chassis.

If it's any consolation, one of the suspension specialist places I spent time at said that harsh rear ride is also a problem for ambulances on the E-450 chassis. So it's not just a Chinook thing. That's not to say one shouldn't try to improve it though. I certainly did because I enjoy driving.

[FatBuoy]

Its still a truck and its a heavy truck weighing in at 10,400 lbs dry, thats over 5 tons. You can throw parts at it for the next 10 years and it will still ride like a 5 ton truck. Part of the problem is they have such limited suspension travel, lifting it helps some if you use springs to do it versus blocks because you increase the travel distance before the suspension hits the bump stops. Once you start lifting an I-beam suspension you start running into alignment issues, sometimes even finding a shop that will attempt an alignment can be a challenge once they realize it isnt factory suspension. Then you have the ones that will do an alignment and try to use factory specs on a lifted truck and you end up with your truck wandering all over the road. But again its a truck, its never going to ride like the family sedan no matter what you do.

Ok Buzzie McBuzzkill! lol! Just messing with you. I agree.

I'm pretty sure I'll never do this but, again, here's the video for the lift solution that could be a game changer. It includes reworked I-beams to address to what you are referring. But a 6" lift. Wow. With that much, I would assume you would be going larger on the tires, which would put you another 1" or more higher. Pretty soon you would have to put red airline warning lights on the a/c unit! I think it would ride nicer, and have more clearance, but there's always a trade-off. That being $4k + installation, and having to worry more about top clearance. Shoot, at 7" higher, it would start becoming a PIA to enter and exit as well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65TNK3hKUsc

It is not a game changer. Its what i have on the front of mine. They use 1/2 ton f150/bronco coilsprings on front. Its nearly impossible to get aligned properly.
There are others that have it and have posted how much they love it. But if you get on expedition portal and the sportsmobile forum, you will find a common theme, complaints about not being able to get a proper alignment. In fact mine is coming off this summer to convert to 4x4 so if you wanna try your luck you can buy mine. I wont even get into the steering box issue.

Hey Doug- looking this over again. In your opinion, a coil lift up front, no matter how you accomplish it, will most likely lead to issues? I've talked to WeldTec, with the game changer and Action Van, who use a block in the rear, but coils up front as well. WeldTec uses new leaf springs in the rear.

You mention ditching it all, and going 4x4. I'm assuming that would give you leaf springs up front, correct? How would that be different? Because you are now working with a whole new front axle as well? Did you use WeldTec, specifically, for your lift? I'm just curious as both they and Action use new radius arms, and WT also bends the I-Beams, which by the way, Action was strongly against because they were never intended to be bent.

Just hard to tell what's up and what's down.